Josie Gronbach

This convocation was unlike any of the other convocations that I have been to this semester. Eric Dregni gave a great presentation that kept my attention the entire time, his stories and readings from his book were filled with humor and interesting information. Hearing him speak about his experience as an American going to live in another culture, which does not seem like it would be all that different from ours, was intriguing. His experience with going over to Norway with his wife, just finding out she is pregnant, and dealing with insurance and coverage of childbirth in Norway was a story in and of itself. In Norway, the taxes are really high, but the healthcare and many other things are covered by the government completely. It was interesting to hear Dregni state that he never really heard any complaints about the high taxes, that they chose to pay that much as it pays off in the end. Then to hear him speak of his challenge of finding his family roots was intriguing because I have family over there as well. I found it interesting how he said he was greeted as being welcomed back when he said he had roots there, even though he was not from Norway himself.

The speakers such as Mr. Yang Long and Ms. Choua Thao, along with other Hmong refugees that were accustomed to the Hmong culture and lifestyle were in my mind as Eric Dregni spoke today. He was joking and finding humor in some of the activities and cultural norms that are normal to everyday society over in Norway. I found this interesting because to the Norwegians, it is completely normal to leave their babies in their carriages outside of stores unattended, but in America, a parent could be charged with child abuse. These differences, as well as language differences and understandings of the English language in Norway was a bit different, not understanding the connotations that are known to be with certain words. This connected to the Hmong refugee speakers in that they found many things in this culture that they found strange and did not understand. Something that the Hmong refugees may have seen as absurd and would laugh at would be completely normal to everyday society in America.

I am really glad I was able to hear Eric Dregni speak, his presentation was very interesting to me. I have some very strong roots in Norway and this really played with my mind and my desire to seek out my relatives. I really learned though, that adjusting to a new and different culture is seen as something completely different depending on what perspective is being taken. For the outsider coming in, there are so many things different and/or missing, but for those in the land, there is humor found in broken societal norms and at times disgust. I think it is so important to have patience with people no matter how subtle or drastic the chance may be in their immigration process.

This Monday night's session was once again a surprising experience. Seexeng Lee came in and told about Hmong art. Lee spoke full of pride of his culture and the development of Hmong art. In such a passionate manner Lee spoke generally about artists, but also his own struggle. Lee is now a teacher of art, but still has his own projects or works of art. Lee shared with us that the most common form of art in the Hmong culture is Paj Ntaub, which is an embroidered piece of cloth that is done by women. These clothes are depictions of Hmong history, but are very useful. These cloths originated in a refugee camp and were intended for a specific function. These would be used as baby carriers, among other uses. Lee then spoke his own story and history. He was born in a refugee camp, but when he came to America he struggled. His father worked very hard for his family and when Lee decided to be an artist his father could not understand why he would do that. On top of struggling to be American and living the Hmong lifestyle, Lee was faced with the challenge of his career. Lee had many great insights that kept the class interested.

Seexeng Lee definitely connects to the other Hmong speakers, and also the books we have read on immigration and the Hmong culture. Lee took this a new direction though and gave the perspective of the arts behind the history. The instruments that are used and the cloths that are used in every day Hmong culture are all handmade and have great significance. All of the history that we have previously heard about Hmong culture was very prevalent in art that Lee showed and spoke about throughout his presentation. I found that his experience was similar to that of Kao Kalia Yang, who was from the same generation of Hmong people.

I was quite surprised at the amount of significance art plays into the Hmong culture. It was very interesting to see how all of the cultural history aspects play into much Hmong art. One thing that I found interesting was that the most prominent medium of art in Hmong culture was the Paj Ntaub, which is done by woman. This is interesting to me because woman do not seem to have a very high place in Hmong society, but this seems to prove that wrong to an extent. Also, I found it interesting that Lee's mother, when asked why she never said "I love you" to her son, that she shows her love every day. She stated that any person could say that, it seemed shallow to her. This changed my perspective on the way in which the Hmong interpret love because it seemed that that was not something said, but there is a purpose for that.

    It is one thing to see the Hollywood version of torture, but when names and actual experiences are told, it does not take long for the stomach to tighten into a knot. I was very excited to hear what this speaker from the Center for Victims of Torture (CVT) had to say about his experience at CVT. Skyler Dickson is a senior at Bethel University and came prepared with statistics, experiences, and different perspectives. I was very interested in hearing about the reasons why people get tortured in the first place. Those who are highly educated or hold influence are often tortured the most, as the government does not want them to take over. Torture is also used to pry information out of victims, which very seldom results in accurate information. A main reason why torture is used is to evoke fear in the citizens so that they will do whatever they are told. Dickson talked about the four different types of torture: physical, psychological, deprivation of human conditions, and sensory overload. This really expands how one in our American culture views torture. Dickson also spoke about his personal experience as befriending a client from CVT that was tortured. This is a very confidential process due to the fear of the individuals of being persecuted.

            This is related to the other speakers that we have had thus far in Honors, as far as the Hmong refugees go. The people that come to the CVT are refugees or are immigrants seeking asylum. These individuals have experienced not only horrible treatment from the people of their country, but do not have the familiarity of this new land. It has to be much harder for the victims of torture to try and start a new life in a strange country, knowing what awaits them back at their homes, but still not feeling at home here. Dickson talked about the struggles that many of the CVT clients have had as far as getting jobs, learning English, and the financial end of the spectrum. These struggles are very similar to the ones we heard about from Kao Kalia Yang, Ms Choua, and Mr. Yang. These are also very similar to the struggles of the immigrants and refugees whose stories were told in the book The Middle of Everywhere by Mary Pipher.

            My perspective on this topic has gone from a very narrowed way of thinking about torture to a very broadened way of thinking. It is so easy to see some sort of an act of torture portrayed on the television, but when the stories come alive and the different types of torture are explained I was appalled. This was a great experience to learn about this topic, as there was first hand statistics and experiences that made the acts of torture even more real. I no longer will look at acts of torture as something that does not really effect a person, but as ruining a human life.

    Monday night, February 23, 2009, the Honors class had an amazing opportunity, having a panel of three Hmong students from CSP come and talk to us. Each of them talked about the history of their families as a whole and then were able to expand on their own beliefs and life between the Hmong and American cultures. Xia Yang, Pa Houa Yang, and Xang Lee were gracious enough to take time out of their busy school schedules and share their beliefs that are very unlike those of any person in the room. It was interesting to hear of their struggles here while living in a traditional Hmong home and going to school in a very Americanized culture growing up. The two women expressed how they are content with their status as a woman and not being able to ever leave the house, and being a "good girl" by cooking, cleaning, babysitting siblings, and doing chores. Xang expressed more of a like for the Americanized culture in some respects, but he still honors and respects his Hmong roots. We were able to hear about the traditions of marriage and funerals, but they also dispelled myths about the Hmong people in relation to rituals and daily living. These very respectful students provided a large amount of new information concerning life in a foreign culture for their parents and the switch between the two cultures for themselves.

            This greatly relates to the Hmong speakers we have had in the past, such as Lee Pao Xiong, Long Yang, Choua Thao, and Kao Kalia Yang. These three students did provide some more interesting information that had not yet been touched on, but they still gave a general history of their families. Each of their history stories about their families were quite similar in many respects to the stories of past speakers, in terms of the refugee camps and the war. This also was quite related to the book, The Middle of Everywhere, in that this book gave quite a significant amount of information about immigrant and refugee families which had similar struggles as the ones each student expressed. Also, the book that Kao Kalia Yang wrote, The Latehomecomer had similar experiences expressed.

            There were some interesting pieces of information that these three Hmong students were able to express or share with the Honors class that we have not heard much on yet. They spoke about the traditional Hmong lifestyle. I found it very interesting to see that the women of the Hmong families must at all times be at home, but the males are free to do what they like. Pa Haou Yang and Xia Yang were very proud of their traditional Hmong lifestyle and are looking to carry that on for their children, but the same could not be said for Xang. This was interesting to me because the two women who have no freedom and are seen as very inferior, but the male who has freedom does not think that this is the greatest or only way to live. This, along with other rituals and traditions discussed, changed my perspective on the roles of each gender in the Hmong culture. I was under the impression, due Ms. Choua coming in and being very authoritative, that women were quite outspoken, but hearing the inferiority of women from these three students was quite a change of perspective. Overall it was great hearing from these three individuals, as what they expressed really clarified some of the assumptions that I had been making about the Hmong culture.

            The greatest connection that I can make from this Exhibition to other class materials is the book, The Middle of Everywhere. This book tells the stories of many immigrants and refugees coming to the United States. Each artist that shared their works at this Exhibition each had their own stories to tell about when they, along with their families, immigrated over to the United States. This is also connected to the three generations of Hmong speakers that we have had the chance to listen to. It was enjoyable hearing their stories about coming to America as refugees. Each of these stories is unique to each individual, but they are all similar in that they had similar struggles with entering into a new culture and still trying to hold on to some of the old  cultural customs.

    After hearing these artists speak about their family histories and seeing how they expressed that in their artworks, I feel that I can better feel what these immigrants and refugees go through or experience in a new culture. As I am a visual person, being able to see the highlights of coming to a new culture, as well as the struggles and shocking factors. I have a greater deal of respect for those who come to the Unites States as either refugees or immigrants. I realized how much I take for granted that I live in this culture and understand the social norms, whereas these refugees and immigrants are not aware of the social norms and seem to have to learn them through rough experiences. Also, being able to hear the actual artists themselves explain and talk about their works in general was a great way to truly enhance the pieces of art and make them come alive.

                Hearing from yet another firsthand experience of the Hmong history in the Monday evening class with guest speakers, Mr. Long Yang and Ms. Choua Thao, was a great experience. They brought much laughter and appreciation to the classroom. Mr. Yang first spoke about the history of the Hmong, with the war and why the Hmong became refugees. He told a bit about his personal experience working for the American government while still in Laos. Throughout his speech, Mr. Yang had on a smile and was very excited to tell about the history of his people, as he himself experienced it. It is hard to believe that this soft spoken, short man that spoke slightly broken English had such an experience at a young age. Ms. Choua was not much different from that. When she walked into the room, I looked at her from the perspective that I would look at my own grandmother. She was small, round face, and seemed somewhat timid. Was I ever wrong! Ms. Choua's voice exploded in the small Honor's classroom, with liveliness, determination, and excitement. Every last inch of that room was filled with her energy when she spoke, as her life experience has taught her to be strong-willed and to be a good advocate for yourself and others you serve. She started out by stating that her name meant tornado, which she attributes her strength to. She was a mother at age sixteen, while at that time caring for her blind grandmother in the midst of a war. When she finally came over to the United States she had six children, but would still work full time and then go to night classes every night. She was and is a very determined woman and hearing her speak about her life experiences was very exciting and evoked a large amount of eagerness to go out into the world and achieve.

            This experience was quite similar to that of listening to the speaker from the Hmong center a week before and also was related to Kao Kalia Yang. Each of these speakers lived through the Hmong experience in different ways, as each was from a different generation. Each of these speakers spoke of the history and war which made the Hmong people refugees in the first place. Telling about the same thing, but then when it came to their personal experiences and opinions, there were slight differences which arrived from their own situations. Mr. Yang and Ms. Choua were from a generation that remembers the war and history the best, as they were old enough to remember such events. Ms. Choua was sixteen and pregnant when she was helping her blind grandmother hide in a hole dug into the ground during attacks of the war, whereas Kalia was just born in that time. Each of their stories was related in so many ways, just as far as the Hmong culture goes.

            I have even more respect for the Hmong people after hearing about the war experience and refugee experience from Mr. Yang and Ms. Choua. Trying to raise and care for a family in the time of war and tribulation had to be most difficult. Hearing from the parent's point of view has really helped me to understand more of what it must have been like to live through that experience. These are strong people and will fight for their lives and the lives of their families. It has been most interesting to hear from these different generations, but to finally hear from those who were living the war the most and having the burden of a large family has really changed how I look at the Hmong people today.

    In my personal opinion there is no better way to learn about an experience than to hear from someone that lived that experience first-hand. Hearing Lee Pao Xiong talk about the place where he grew up and about all of the tragic events that he lived through, was a really great experience. Xiong talked about how he grew up in a valley where the CIA was stationed and where his father served in the military. When he spoke about his life growing up there he would say something that would be a rather traumatizing experience to those looking from the outside view, but it was what he was used to in those surroundings. He would end each phrase with a slight laugh or giggle, which really seemed to express to me how innocent he was at the time. When he spoke of the time when the airplanes were taking the refugees, and that his father had not been able to get onto the same airplane as he and his mother seemed absolutely horrifying. The fact that he went through these traumatizing experiences and is now able to share those with us, as well as being able to see how successful he is now, was very uplifting.

            It was interesting to hear the difference in how Xiong told his story and how Kao Kalia Yang told her story. Kalia was very much emotionally involved in what she had experienced and spoke of her past in such a way, whereas Xiong simply told his story in a very straight forward manner. I feel as if I am getting a better-rounded picture of what the Hmong history is about. The simple differences between having a man and woman speak, along with being different ages really helped better complete the Hmong history. Yet, in these differences, there were still many similarities and places where their stories overlapped. The book, The Middle of Everywhere, was a great set up as well for hearing these speakers. It helped me to better understand the long process and hardship of coming to America as a refugee. Both Kalia and Xiong touched on their experience of coming to America and by reading that book previous to that, I was able to open up my heart and mind to their real life struggles.

            After hearing Xiong speak, my mind has been challenged with thinking about the life that a child lives in a war-zone. Xiong spoke so naively about his life growing up, that to him seeing dead bodies and seeing people being killed was nothing unusual. I could not imagine having to raise a child in such an environment, which really puts perspective on how fortunate all Americans are, we don't have to worry about being woken up in the middle of the night and being rushed down to a bomb shelter. That life was normal to Xiong, which is terrifying to think that he has seen worse things as a child than some adults ever see. I also found it interesting to hear his thoughts on how the Americans did not help the Hmong refugees at all, there seems to be a rather significant misunderstanding about how that all went. I think it is always good to hear the mistakes that the American government makes, to see that even the world power country makes mistakes.

    The events leading up to seeing Grand Torino were very key in my experience of the movie. I went and saw the movie on Friday, January 30, the day that Kao Kalia Yang came and spoke to the class. After hearing her in her quiet, smooth, and poetic voice talk about her experience firsthand, I felt more connected or in tune to what life is like for the Hmong people as a whole. I was not fully aware of what to expect with the movie Grand Torino, I had not heard of it until I saw it in the syllabus for Honors. I had mentioned that I was going to see this movie to several friends and they gave it great reviews, so when I sat down in the theatre I was excited to finally see this movie. While watching this movie, I felt very removed from the outside world, like I was living in the moment. I had never realized the kind life many Hmong families have here in America. I was moved by the performances of many of the actors and actresses, which made the movie even better. By the end I was wiping away tears and trying to wrap my mind around what I had just seen. This movie seemed so real to me and with the setting being right here in St. Paul, I felt even more so connected to the story. This experience was very eye opening and I am very grateful for the opportunity to see it.

            As I mentioned above, hearing Kao Kalia Yang talk about her experience here as a Hmong in America was a great set up for when I went to go see Grand Torino. Kalia's book, The Latehomecomer, really parallels that of the story line of Grand Torino in the respect that there are trials and misunderstandings as to who the Hmong people are. Kalia did a great job of focusing on the Hmong people as a whole and their experiences, more a universal story than a personal take on how the lives of the Hmong. Grand Torino definitely takes a specific route in telling the story of one family, which is the nature of movies. This movie also connected to the book we read earlier, The Middle of Everywhere. In this particular book it was interesting to see the experience of the refugees and immigrants coming to America from the perspective of an American. I felt on some level that me watching Grand Torino was like that of the perspective Mary Pipher. Reading her book and then watching this movie was a great way to notice how much we as Americans can so quickly judge a people without knowing their background and life stories. The character Clint Eastwood played was the greatest example of this in Grand Torino.

            Watching Grand Torino did in fact change my perspective on the Hmong people. My heart is definitely more open to hear their stories and learn about their history. I am also more understanding about their different rituals and also where they are coming from in daily situations. I feel that there is not enough respect and acknowledgement given to the Hmong people. They have such a rich history and have many struggles. I am amazed at how naïve I was coming into this semester; I had no idea about the Hmong culture and refugees of America in general. This movie has definitely cleared up several misunderstandings I had about Hmong culture and for that I am very grateful.  

Reading The Middle of Everywhere was an eye opening experience for me. When I used to think about immigrants and refugees, I would not allow my mind to wander much. I would stick to the knowledge that I had picked up on through the stereotypes and stigmas given these people from other Americans. In general, the average citizen born in America is completely oblivious to the fortune and endless opportunities in to which they were born. Along with this, Americans seem to take possession of the land, opportunities, and freedom given them, without stepping back and looking at how they got those items in the first place. This is where this book really started to make me think. We as Americans are very uneducated about our history and fail to appreciate what is given to us and the sacrifices made that got us to the place we are today. The immigrants and refugees that came here to America are not only appreciative of what is given to them, but also are very aware of their own country's background and seem eager to learn about the history of America. In reading this book I felt I was given more reason to let my mind wander and think more about the lives of immigrants and refugees as real people with some very disturbing real stories.

                Once we discussed this book in class, I found so many different perspectives to take in addition to the ones I had already found. I enjoyed hearing the different perspectives and learning more about the history of people in the Honor's class to be very enlightening. Even in our small class in the Midwest, there are still varying stories and histories that really broadened the discussion. Being this is the first real discussion that we have had thus far in the semester, I find it a bit difficult to make comparisons from other course materials, but with the semester ahead being very heavily focused on immigrants, refugees, and the marginalized in general, this book I feel has prepared me to be more open to what I will be exposed to this semester. With that said, I could deduce that my thinking on this matter is quite changed. I feel much more open to hear the stories, learn the history, and dig into how different our culture is from others and how that is a challenge for those immigrants and refugees when moving here to America.

The term used widely in the Christian community to describe rising from the dead and turning water into wine, would most commonly be, miracle. Yet, this term is never actually used in the Bible. So where did this term come from and what does it mean exactly? Phil Dowe takes on this question in his book, Galileo, Darwin, and Hawking, while making a point about his idea of a corresponding interaction between religion and science. Dowe uses the ideas from several different philosophers that date back to the eighteenth century in forming his argument. He utilizes the works of David Hume and George Schlesinger, among others to give perspectives to his discussion. Even though he pulls ideas from these models of thought, Dowe does not necessarily agree with each idea, which is both a strength and weakness in his argument of a harmonious interaction between religion and science in terms of miracles.

                Dowe has a certain view which he portrays by going through and examining the different perspectives of philosophers. First, Dowe uses the model of thought from Hume, which is an, "analysis of miracles and their significance for religion" (82). In Hume's thought there are two ways in which to undertake the questions of what a miracle is and whether they prove the existence of God. Hume initially goes about defining miracles as a, "very unlikely event" (87). From here Hume explains that the level of belief that a miracle occurred corresponds directly to the amount of evidence there is that the miracle happened. The evidence that Hume states must be met is related to that of law and probability. The laws of nature must be defied in order for a miracle to occur, which Dowe argues that there is simply no way to prove that there is not a law. In every case the laws of nature would win. The evidence then completely relies on the testimony and the probability of the testimony of the person/people that witnessed the miracle. Dowe argues this by pointing out that there is not a constant in which testimonies can be measured against, the reliability of the witnesses and the possibility of conflicting testimonies throws out this option. With Dowe's arguments against these initial thoughts of Hume, the secondary argument which tries to answer if miracles happen and whether these prove the existence of God are no longer relevant. Thus, Hume's attempt to use miracles as evidence for God's existence does nothing other than confuses the discussion of miracles in conjunction to religion.

                With Hume's model ruled out, Dowe then uses the thoughts of George Schlesinger. "Schlesinger defends religion as a rational enterprise by utilizing inference to the best explanation, a kind of argument form found in science" (99). The inference to the best explanation takes a common piece of assumed evidence and pairs that with two separate hypotheses. Then the decision is made as to which set is more probable, the evidence with hypothesis one or the evidence with hypothesis two. Dowe gives several examples using this technique with the concept of miracles known in the Bible. The evidence assumed is the miracle itself and the two hypotheses are explanations to the miracle. Then he examines the possibilities with the assumed evidence and concluded that, in this particular example, that God making something happen is more likely than there being no God at all and that everything is explainable by means of science. In this manner Dowe then states his proof that there is a common ground in which science and religion meet. It is through rational that each of these is proven. Dowe states that, "the method of inference to the best explanation, a method used widely in science, also can be used to justify the rationality of belief in God" (95). He then concludes that science and religion can in fact be held in a harmonious relationship through use of miracles.

                Upon examining Dowe's argument of the relationship between science and religion in the context of miracles, there could be seen several positive aspects as well as a few negative. Dowe does an excellent job with establishing his credibility by taking on different perspectives of the argument, not simply explaining his viewpoint. By analyzing the models of thought from several different philosophers, Dowe was able to rule out all other possibilities. Once he went through the other aspects of the argument, he ended with his idea of the argument with ample explanation. While examining each perspective Dowe did an excellent job of giving examples to allow the reader to understand fully why he was or was not refuting the claims. Along with giving examples in describing the perspectives, he broke down the models and defined terms in a way that allowed a person to see his point even more. In his discussion of Hume's arguments, he does an excellent job of utilizing all of these techniques. Although in his discussion of Schlesinger's use of the inference to the best explanation, Dowe is slightly less effective with presenting his point. The inference to the best explanation is the way in which he connects science and religion, but the practical use of this test seems less than applicable in the scientific world where evidence and processes are a must. Truthfully, this test is based solely on the opinion of the person administering the test. One may argue one way and another person may argue the other. There is not a constant in this test, which slightly undercuts his argument as to the harmonious interaction between science and religion. Thus his conclusion seems to be a weakness in his argument due to the fact that his conclusion is based on opinion.

                Overall Dowe's approach to his discussion and argument was laid out well. The answers to the questions of miracles still seem to be up in the air, but with the knowledge that Dowe gives, each individual is more equipped to make an adequate decision based on what they believe. It is helpful that Dowe used information from several different philosophers, allowing for several different perspectives to be taken. This not only will aid people in their own thoughts on this matter, but it strengthened Dowe's argument. Even though he did seem to have a minor flaw in the final portion of his perspective argument, his attempt to prove the possibility of a harmonious relationship between science and religion was well done.